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News Blog

Enforcing BYU's honor code with threats of arrest

by Eric Peterson

Posted // 2010-07-08 - An issue I had wanted to delve into more for this week’s cover story was how BYU has considered students who don’t comply with the Honor Code as trespassing. One former student was threatened with criminal trespass for having facial hair on campus.

Jason Brown, a former student at BYU recalls on numerous occasions flaunting BYU’s rule on unauthorized facial hair, but recalls a time in 2007 he pushed his luck enough that he was escorted out of the BYU library by campus police. “I didn’t have a computer and it’s like a discreet computer lab within the library,” Brown says. “But they have people that are staffing the lab and some of the guys have a tendency to patrol the place looking for scruffy men I guess.”

Brown says he was asked to leave and decided to tell the staff he wasn’t leaving until he finished the assignment he was working on. After refusing the order, Brown says a supervisor repeated the warning. After Brown still wouldn’t budge, campus police soon came in and escorted him out. As Brown was being led out of the library he shouted to the library that he was being arrested for not shaving. While the students assembled got a laugh out of it Brown says the campus police officer did not find the outburst amusing.

“The cop said ‘do you think this is funny?’” Brown recalls. “I said 'I don’t think this is funny. I think this is ridiculous'. He then took my name and information and said the next time it happened I would be arrested for trespassing.”

The issue of honor code non-compliance as trespass also extended to a number of students who joined in protests against the policy in 2007 that lead to it’s clarification regarding gay students. Student protesters were told they also could be arrested for trespass. When asked about the honor code being enforced with the added threat of arrest for trespass, BYU’s Honor Code Office Director Steve Baker wrote via e-mail: “I am not familiar with either of these situations.”

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REPLY TO THIS COMMENT

Jacob Lewis

Posted // July 8,2010 at 21:50

After reading the cover story and skimming through this little gem, it's suddenly occurred to me:

This Baker guy must have a really TERRIBLE memory!

Any unfair, abusive, hyper aggressive, or otherwise ethically questionable situation brought upon the students by the nefarious "Honor Code" seems to have NEVER HAPPENED as far as Steve Baker's concerned. If only it were possible for students to sue a religious school, rather than just the head Department of Education (like that'll ever happen) I'd like to see Mr. Baker try to pull his Alzheimer act while under oath.

Fact of the matter is that BYU gets FEDERAL FUNDING and uses that funding to violate the constitutional rights of American citizens. It's perfectly allowed to do that AS LONG AS IT DOESN'T USE FEDERAL FUNDING TO DO SO. It's the same exact story with the boy scouts.

Anyone remember that first amendment thing that points out that church and state are separate? This is an example of that separation failing. These kids deserve some protection.

REPLY TO THIS COMMENT

glenn

Posted // July 8,2010 at 20:11

im sorry, if you are gay and go to BYU, you are an idiot. there are tons of us straight virgin non drinking extremely active mormons who wouldn't last three days down there. I left BYU after 3 days. I don't feel sorry for these people. I knew I wouldn't last. I knew that If I made a commitment to go to BYU I wouldn't be able to last there. These idiots made a commitment to live by BYU rules, and they pussed out, now they are blaming BYU. Again, idiots.

REPLY TO THIS COMMENT

John K.

Posted // July 8,2010 at 17:16

While I agree, this is a private university and can make its own rules, I LOVE that this guy is doing this because these types of policies need all the attention they can get from prospective students who may then likely decline to go there, and hopefully, in a perfect world, put these ridiculous places out of business, or force them to change their ridiculous policies.

REPLY TO THIS COMMENT

Hayduke

Posted // July 8,2010 at 15:14

This dude signed a paper stating that he will abide by a very specific code in order to attend a private university of his choice.

He then blatently flouts the rules, time and again, forcing the school to take action lest other unruly, bearded men observe that the school is not serious about the code.

The school threatens him with disciplinary action, which he considers to be ridiculous.

I think it is ridiculous that that people CHOOSE to go to an extremely conservative, private institution, sign a contract stating that they will uphold the conservative standards and rules of that institution, flout the rules, get in trouble for it, and then complain about it. That's ridiculous.

I have no pity for these people at all, zero, ziltch, nada. This was their choice. They all made the personal desicion to attend BYU, knowing that they would be expected to follow BYU rules. They then made the personal decision to break those rules, knowing that there could and probably would be consequences.

It irks me when people are promised specific consequences for specific actions who then challenge that promise, find that it holds, and then complain about it. It's like a bank robber complaining to cops that he just can't get a break robbing banks in this town.

Make a different choice next time, one that you can live with, one that suits your lifestyle. It is as simple as that.

Hayduke

Posted // July 12,2010 at 09:08 - Jesse, It is absolutely true that many gay Mormon men are taught that by adhering to the faith, the urges they harbor will subside and they will magically turn straight. I empathize those guys - must be hell. Upon the passing of Prop 8, one of my dearest friends left The Church officially. But when we discuss religion or what may come of the afterlife, his views are still those of any other Mormon, with the exception that gays will be accepted by God and will receive any and all blessings that any other good Mormon would receive, even though that is not what Mormons teach. I don't understand that, either. He suffered a great deal under that religion, is no longer officially part of it, and yet, still believes in it. People are complicated and situations like this one involving BYU are rarely simple or easy to understand. Your comments are greatly appreciated and, because they are sincere, afford me an opportunity to view things from a different perspective. Thanks for that.

Jesse Fruhwirth

Posted // July 9,2010 at 18:52 - Perhaps my last thought on this. "But man, there's not one single gay kid attending BYU that didn't know he or she was gay beforehand." That's just factually untrue. Even people who do not grow up in very conservative families are often confused about their sexual orientation for many decades, well into middle age and beyond. Additionally, I've spoken to a lot of gay LDS people who believed that living the LDS principles--including going to BYU and a mission, etc.--would "cure" their homosexuality.

Jesse Fruhwirth

Posted // July 9,2010 at 18:19 - And, let me add, for those who have irreconcilable difference with their parents, faith, whatever, make the split. I respect that, too.

Jesse Fruhwirth

Posted // July 9,2010 at 18:16 - 'duke, it's like having racist parents that you love despite their racism. You don't just ditch things you love--that bestowed you with so many great qualities and opportunities--over one or a few disagreements. If you succeed at opening your parents' hearts to extinguishing racism, you haven't "destroyed" them. As for Christianity generally, I'm with Thomas Jefferson: there are amazing and profoundly beautiful lessons that were taught by the philosopher Jesus of Nazareth, but a lot of hocus-pocus dung has gotten mixed in with the diamonds through translations, tribalism, oral tradition drift (in the first decades after Christ's death), regionalism, etc. The LDS faith has similarities, although I know a lot less about the D&C's than Matt, Mark, Luke and John. But even I am aware of aspects of the LDS faith that are very admirable (social welfare, for one). I don't think reform and destruction are the same thing, as you seem to be suggesting. Mormonism without its homophobia, misogyny and a few other pimples could still be Mormonism. I have friends like you, 'duke, who consider Mormon reformers to be vile "fence sitters," but you're right, I have a fresh, relatively unjaded, new-comer perspective (I lack anti-Mormon baggage that so Utahns have in spades). For those people who love the LDS religion but want to reform it, I say rage on Saints! Fight the power!

Hayduke

Posted // July 9,2010 at 11:37 - I completely understand and respect your opinion, Jesse. But if these Mormons are so disappointed with then tenets of their faith, why not start their own religion or join another? If they fight to change Mormonism to suit their personal ideals, and succeed, that religion will no longer exist as Mormonism, anyway. If they just want to destroy it, why not do it simply and leave it behind to die? If they don't believe in their religion as it exists, they don't believe in their religion, period. Again, I do understand your opinion and I'd like to agree. I'm generally a big fan of hard-nosed fighters. But I respect those fighters more when they fight the battles they choose to fight and don't whine about the outcome when it goes awry. Because we grew up in different, geographical worlds, my views may differ from yours regarding certain aspects of Mormonism. Your views are likely less tainted and clearer than mine. I'm not so different from these kids, really, and maybe the similarities I see inform my opinion, prompting me to poke these kids in the chest, telling them to not waste time and move on, because that's exactly what they'll do, eventually. I dunno. All I know is, if you don't like the way the garbage smells, don't move into the garbage can. The smell won't improve with time.

Jesse Fruhwirth

Posted // July 9,2010 at 10:38 - I feel that BYU students and Mormons are entitled to love their school and love their faith enough to demand changes within while maintaining their allegiance. A lot of Mormons love their religion despite what they see as faults; for those people, the best option is to work for reform within the church, or within BYU, whatever the case may be. For me, their chutzpah is admirable, not irksome.

Hayduke

Posted // July 9,2010 at 09:31 - Well, Jesse, I suppose I am blaming the so-called victim in this instance. Nobody volunteered to be drafted (yes, people enlisted voluntarily) and nobody volunteered to live under segregation. These situations were forced upon the individuals that suffered them and those individuals had every right to "complain" and to take action. The people that choose to attend BYU, a notoriously conservative, religious institution, put themselves in a position to be controlled, and not only that, agreed to allow themselves to be controlled or suffer the consequences. They accepted their lot, chose it, in fact, when there were so many other choices to make. They put themselves in a position in which they knew their ideals would be compromised. I know kids are just kids. I know parents hold influence over their children. I know there are various factors behind the choice to attend BYU. But man, there's not one single gay kid attending BYU that didn't know he or she was gay beforehand. And there's not one single gay kid attending BYU that isn't acutely aware of what their religion, and by extension, their religious university, thinks of their lifestyle. But they went anyway. They signed those idiotic papers. They made a promise to conform, to behave, to act like sheep. I don't see any value or sense in making the choice to attend BYU, promising to conform to BYU standards, signing a contract, promising to obey or suffer the consequences, and then crying about it when you don't play along and find that the consequences are, indeed, real. Personally, I find BYU's rules to be extremely lame. I consider their stance on homosexuality to be damaging, mean and shortsighted. I think not being able to wear a beard (or the Mormon goatee) on campus is beyond silly. And that's why I encourage every single gay kid on BYU's campus to turn your back on that institution, enroll someplace else, transfer your credits, and move on with your life. Don't put up with what you cannot stand but can change. Take responsibility for yourself and your actions, accept that you made a mistake. Leave the sheep to the herdsmen and save yourself. You're the only one that can.

Jesse Fruhwirth

Posted // July 9,2010 at 08:27 - re: irks. It's also like men who burned their draft card to protest the draft and people who sat in cafes in the south to challenge segregation. Facial hair at BYU isn't as important as the draft or segregation, but it's the same principal of civil disobedience. You complain, you resist, you pay the consequences, then you complain again (its Gandhi's model). Unless you believe BYU has a legitimate interest in controlling its undergrads' facial hair, Hayduke, aren't you blaming the victim?